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Post by Herzogian on Oct 21, 2017 11:02:07 GMT -5
We recently purchased a monk from a breeder we suspect raised his hatchlings in a dark closet - hence his name Kaspar Hauser. I have had wonderful relationships with Quakers before, and after more than a month, this bird does not exhibit any vivacity or curiosity. He would throw tantrums when handled or if the sun shone through the open blinds. After countless occasions when he has fallen off something in panic or fled from us only to fly into a wall, he now mostly hides from us, but eventually does tolerate some handling and will step up. However he never leaves the area immediately around his cage by himself, and seems immune to bonding with us, although he gets along wonderfully with a budgie cagemate. He is mostly silent throughout the day even with bird sounds playing in the background. After a month we clipped his flight feathers which improved his docility immensely, but there has not been any progress since then. We have tried baiting him with treats and give him run of the apartment which we have decorated with perches and toys for him - he just sits on the perch above his cage and stares at the world from beside his little blue companion. He is close to six months old and has spent almost two months with us. We have tried bribery, drugging him with chamomile, giving him chilies, moving his cage near us, decorating his cage with new toys and perches, peekaboo, tower of terror, reading to him, playing bird sounds, putting him in blankets - nothing, nada, zip, zero, zilch. We are about ready to call it quits and find someone to buy him off us, as it seems doubtful he will ever bond with us or even talk. We are giving him a few more days or weeks to see if any progress can be observed. Otherwise anyone have suggestions about macaw breeds?
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Post by biteybird on Oct 21, 2017 21:35:19 GMT -5
Welcome, Herzogian and Kaspar Hauser!  My advice is that you shouldn't give up on him just yet. You don't know what his life was like for his first 4 months, so he could be really traumatised. If I were in your position I would stop trying so hard to interact with him and let him come to you when he's ready - but it could take quite some time for him to decide to do that. He obviously has little trust at present, possibly due to his upbringing prior to you bringing him home. I also wouldn't try hand contact at the moment, until he starts displaying some interest in his surroundings. If he's not used to sunlight could you provide him with a slightly dimmer space to begin with, then gradually increase the amount of light? Or use a muted/coloured UV lamp? - I don't know much about this part of it, but lots of Forum members do, and I'm sure they will pitch in with some advice for you. I guess it depends if you're in a hurry or not and how much you want him to be part of your family. It sounds as though you are providing him with a very good home. I really hope things work out for you and little Kaspar, as it can be hard for parrots to cope with multiple new homes. Good luck with your decision...whatever you decide you'll find support here on this Forum. |
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Post by easttex on Oct 22, 2017 5:31:35 GMT -5
Welcome to the forum! I agree with biteybird. Kaspar doesn't sound ready for all this attention. If you really want to make it work with him, ease up and let him set the pace.
Put his cage where he can watch everybody, but not in the thick of things. Let him learn your routine without placing any demands on him. Read his body language, and when he seems to be getting more comfortable, put a perch on the outside of his cage (close to the door works well), and keep the door open when you are in the room and can keep an eye on him. Be patient and loving, and don't push him beyond his comfort level.
As biteybird said, he might have been traumatized by something. Or he might have been parent raised. In any case, try to empathize with him. He's been forcibly taken from everything familiar to him and is now in a land of aliens who expect him to perform.
This is important: when you get to a point of frustration/anxiety/negativity/etc., walk away and don't interact with him. They are very sensitive and can mirror your emotions, and it can be hard to break out of that cycle.
I hope you can resolve this to everyone's mutual happiness, but if not, rather than selling him to anyone who is willing to pay, please try to find him an understanding and experienced home. I don't mean this in a harsh way, but I'd recommend against replacing him with a macaw if you can't make it work with Kaspar. They are that much more complicated, and should go to really knowledgeable homes.
Please let us know how it's going with Kaspar.🙂
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Post by Herzogian on Oct 22, 2017 16:40:53 GMT -5
As far as we could tell he was hand raised by a breeder, but may have been kept in the dark outside of feeding. Either way he never seemed right; we almost called him Hodor, but Hodor at least was amicable. He would squawk at sunlight but he adjusted to it after a few days. His cage is in a corner surrounded by plants and perches and he spends most of his time on the perches I set up from fallen pine wood above his cage and leading to different plants (his food mug is often kept at the base of a plant minimize cleanup). So yes, he has it pretty good, he just despises us. On the other hand he loves the little blue cage mate and follows him everywhere for cuddling. The downside is that his unmanageablility infects the budgie and makes him nervous around us.
I personally am a cat person and can see why these flying rats make fun toys, but after being introduced to the “joys” of bird ownership, I have successfully trained a blue budgie to do a few tricks. The little green oagre on the other hand continues to resist civilization. The bird’s foster mother had a Quaker previously and is heartbroken at her failure to make any progress with this feral creature. She was with him for a few weeks before I came back and her method was to grab the bird out of the cage and hug him; so I had a lot of work to do after reading what not to do with new birds - which was basically everything she was doing. I started just sitting their cage next to me until they learned to eat around me and then things became more tolerable after I redecorated everything with perches and we clipped his wings. Still Kaspar definitely hates her more than he does me, but it depends on the day: sometimes he is feral and other times he is an argument against species preservation. Also, he has successfully managed to break off all his tail feathers crashing everywhere - could we try and sell him off as a Quaker-Amazon hybrid (“Quakazon”)?
In short we are still trying with him, but we’re also resigned to the probability that he would probably prefer another family or a life as a breeder bird.
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Post by easttex on Oct 22, 2017 16:56:53 GMT -5
I'd suggest you separate the two birds. It might be necessary in the long run anyway, because Kaspar may eventually become cage possessive. It's common in Quakers. He might take more of an interest in people if he doesn't have a bird companion, and it might be easier on your budgie.
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Post by Herzogian on Oct 23, 2017 1:06:52 GMT -5
Read the following article that confirmed our experience: www.beautyofbirds.com/earlysocializationofpetbirds.htmlThis bird was raised in a dark confinement with a dozen other hatchlings and no toys and seemingly no interaction outside of feeding. We are starting the search for a new buyer. We don’t think separating the birds would be helpful for training. We have tried it before and the budgie just chirps after his separated companion. It’s rather sweet. A lot of our training sessions have been with the birds separated, but the little bird comforts the Quaker (ex. It’s easier to get him on my hand if the budgie is already perched on me). However as sad as it is, we just don’t see this bird developing. I’m not sure readers understand fully that this bird has no curiosity and has the blankest stare even after two months of socialization attempts. I even bought this bird a coconut and new swinging perch. We are looking into getting a new Quaker (lucky number 3) before saving up for a macaw. If anyone near Orlando has any more advice or would be interested in helping rehome him or possibly tame him, let me know and I can open an account here to exchange information. |
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Post by easttex on Oct 23, 2017 8:31:41 GMT -5
To be clearer, I meant separate them completely, not just for training. For one thing, things may be fine now, but once a quaker is sexually mature, it can be very territorial and cage possessive. It's a very natural thing for them. They are often colonial nesters in the wild, but every breeding pair has its own space, and they won't tolerate intrusion. A budgie would be defenseless, and could be maimed or even killed before you knew there was a problem. If I were you, I would consider this before putting another quaker in with your budgie.
Secondly, it is not at all uncommon for parrots, even those properly socialized, to lose interest in people when they are housed with other birds. Obviously, Kaspar has other issues as well, but you've handicapped yourself in allowing him to bond with your budgie. Separating them might be hard on one or both of them, but that's moot if you're going to rehome Kaspar anyway.
His lack of early socialization may well have some permanent effects, but if handled properly, he still could make someone a good companion. It means a big commitment, though. I'd be sorely tempted myself if I lived in your area. I hope you find a good home for him.
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Post by Herzogian on Oct 27, 2017 11:36:38 GMT -5
Kaspar was given to a new family and he seemed much happier with his new people.
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Post by biteybird on Oct 27, 2017 20:12:12 GMT -5
That is good - I'm glad he's happy, although I'm sure you must miss him. |
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Post by pidgesmum on Nov 3, 2017 21:52:09 GMT -5
I wonder if he had sight problems?
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Post by Herzogian on Nov 6, 2017 23:17:20 GMT -5
I never noticed any sight problems. He was a pretty decent flyer - strange that he could fly at all if he was actually in a bird mill - but still crashed around before his wings were clipped. We have since "upgraded" to a B&G macaw and it has been an amazing experience. We might get another budgie to keep the little blue bird happy as he seems to lack company. We do not let him out of the cage unsupervised as the macaw is mostly kept on a perch at all hours - unless he is being unusually aggressive. Although I am slightly tempted to get a blue Quaker and have a range of blue parrots from small to large. Having a macaw is amazing, but I certainly appreciate how much easier a smaller parrot is to manage.
We do wonder about Kaspar and how he is doing, but the buyer was insistent that this was the bird for her despite our warnings that he was a little ruff around the edges - and she had had a Quaker before and said that this was the best bird they had seen. We lost her number, so we can only assume the creature is happy and adjusted.
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nene
Hatchling
Posts: 5
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Post by nene on Feb 18, 2018 11:25:03 GMT -5
No not hopeless. I have a male that the previous owner poked with sticks. Rocky will now hang out with us even allowing my husband to touch him . I just let him decide how long it would take to trust us and feel safe, that was a long year. Now it is two years and I still cant touch him but we are very close and he demands my attention. We are now like newbies with both setting boundries and testing them . LOTS of patience, time and love. As far as we could tell he was hand raised by a breeder, but may have been kept in the dark outside of feeding. Either way he never seemed right; we almost called him Hodor, but Hodor at least was amicable. He would squawk at sunlight but he adjusted to it after a few days. His cage is in a corner surrounded by plants and perches and he spends most of his time on the perches I set up from fallen pine wood above his cage and leading to different plants (his food mug is often kept at the base of a plant minimize cleanup). So yes, he has it pretty good, he just despises us. On the other hand he loves the little blue cage mate and follows him everywhere for cuddling. The downside is that his unmanageablility infects the budgie and makes him nervous around us. I personally am a cat person and can see why these flying rats make fun toys, but after being introduced to the “joys” of bird ownership, I have successfully trained a blue budgie to do a few tricks. The little green oagre on the other hand continues to resist civilization. The bird’s foster mother had a Quaker previously and is heartbroken at her failure to make any progress with this feral creature. She was with him for a few weeks before I came back and her method was to grab the bird out of the cage and hug him; so I had a lot of work to do after reading what not to do with new birds - which was basically everything she was doing. I started just sitting their cage next to me until they learned to eat around me and then things became more tolerable after I redecorated everything with perches and we clipped his wings. Still Kaspar definitely hates her more than he does me, but it depends on the day: sometimes he is feral and other times he is an argument against species preservation. Also, he has successfully managed to break off all his tail feathers crashing everywhere - could we try and sell him off as a Quaker-Amazon hybrid (“Quakazon”)? In short we are still trying with him, but we’re also resigned to the probability that he would probably prefer another family or a life as a breeder bird. |
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